2008 March 27 Thursday
The American internet firm Network Solutions had originally accepted to host the web site of Geert Wilders for the purpose of broadcasting the Fitna movie at the web site http://www.fitnathemovie.com/ , but a week before the movie was released, Network Solutions suspended (froze) this site "until it finishes investigating the complaints against this film, and whether the web site's content was in violation of the 'Network Solutions Acceptable Use Policy'".
1) If I understood what I have read in the news, the censorship by Network Solution occurred approximately one week before the movie files were supposed to be uploaded to the web site (which originally only displayed the ad "Fitna Movie Coming Soon." In other words, this was pre-emptive censorship based on the complaints Network Solutions received.
2) Secondly, there are allegations in the news, claiming that although the Geert Wilders web site (originally allocated for the Fitna movie) was censored by Network Solutions, this internet company actually hosts a site that belongs to Hezollah. Here is an article which claims that the same American internet company that censored the Geert Wilders web site, actually hosts a Hezbollah web site:
My apologies for the error! An update in the news about Network Solutions, says that Network Solutions only registered the domain of Hezbollah, but that it did not directly host the Hezbollah web site.
In any case, there are more details about the reaction to the Fitna movie at Wikipedia:
Well, I suppose that no senior corporate executive wants to wake up first thing in the morning with a razor-sharp scimitar at their throat.
That really is what it all boils down too.
Apparently, it was not just the corporate executives, but all the employees of the corporation, collectively and unanimously, decided to become cooperative by showing flexibility and understanding, by removing the the Geert Wilders movie from the liveleak.com web site.
I am trying to find places to watch the video. The Muslims are scaring lots of companies out of showing it.
If we didn't allow Muslims to live in the West we wouldn't have to live in such fear.
It looks like the video is still on Google video, but Google video suck. That's why they forked out nearly a billion and a half for youtube. It's utterly and completely unusable over dial-up.
Use BitTorrent (a file sharing program)
The files are not stored on a central server the site just holds a torrent file which links you to sharers, users can upload new torrent file at will.
So if something is popular it will always be on.
The question is not if there are radical Muslims that exist and that are represented in these films. The question is out of the 1 billion Muslims on earth, how many of them hold these views and those who hold these fews how many are radicalize to act or support violent acts against non-Muslims.
I would imagine world wide, the percentage is probably less than 5% if that. So you are judging 1 billion people by less than 50 million people.
I would admit that radical Islam or "orthodox Islam" (which I believe is fairly radical even if it is not exactly the same as Islamic terrorist groups) is not compatible with Islam. That being said I have known Muslims in China, Japan, and especially in the U.S. I have known and worked with/associated with/befriended Muslims from Pakistan, UAE, Lebanon, Turkey, Somalia, Nigeria, Ivory Coast, China (Uygur and Hui), Indonesia, India, Russia, Morocco, Iran. None of those people did I feel felt like they wanted to kill me for being agnostic, take over a non-Muslim nation, murder Christians, murder other Muslims of different denominations, blow up someone, blow up themselves, etc. I will say that none of them (that I spoke to about the issue) were fond of Israel or America's policies concerning Israel and Palestine due to what they feel are the mistreatment of the Palestinians (Muslims and Christians), however I know plenty of whites and black Christians who feel the exact same way in America and in Europe that opinion is fairly strong among whites from various countries, so it is not radical but for certain right wing Americans and pro-Zionist Jews (not all Jews support Israel, I know a few who do not).
So once again, I think before we give into paranoid delusion that are people from the Muslim faith are secretly involved in some James Bond style Cold War level conspiracy to murder all non-Muslim men who won't convert and make sex slaves out of the "blond women" we should keep things in perspective.
Creating an "us vs them" scenario when "them" is 1 billion people is not a good scenario to embark on. All Muslims are not the enemy and it is clear to me that many Muslims fear right wing radical Muslims as much (or more) than we do because most of the victims of their attacks are other Muslims (historically) not non-Muslims (at least in the last 40 years). It would behoove us, in a world that will become increasingly globalized (despite Randy's ravings, to make allies with those who can help us fight a common enemy even if we don't see eye to eye politically on various subjects. Most rational people (even in Egypt or Turkey) do not believe blowing up women and children is a good moral thing. If they did they would not have secret cells in these nations.
You are absolutely right. Not all Muslims are our enemies. The only Muslims who are our enemies are the Muslims who believe the Arabic Qur'an is the unadulterated word of God in God's language of choice. If we remove all of those Muslims, we can live with the remainder.
OK Bob Badour, even if we can live with the Muslims who don't believe the Quran is the word of God, why would we want to?
There's a big flaw at the heart of your argument: You assume only Muslims who are terrorists are a threat to our liberty.
Polls of Muslims in Britain tell me enough to want to keep Muslims out of the US:
YouGov sought to gauge the character of the Muslim community's response to the events of July 7. As the figures in the chart show, 88 per cent of British Muslims clearly have no intention of trying to justify the bus and Tube murders.
However, six per cent insist that the bombings were, on the contrary, fully justified.
Six per cent may seem a small proportion but in absolute numbers it amounts to about 100,000 individuals who, if not prepared to carry out terrorist acts, are ready to support those who do.
Moreover, the proportion of YouGov's respondents who, while not condoning the London attacks, have some sympathy with the feelings and motives of those who carried them out is considerably larger - 24 per cent.
I want to keep Muslims out in order to keep out Sharia law:
Four out of 10 British Muslims want sharia law introduced into parts of the country, a survey reveals today.
The ICM opinion poll also indicates that a fifth have sympathy with the "feelings and motives" of the suicide bombers who attacked London last July 7, killing 52 people, although 99 per cent thought the bombers were wrong to carry out the atrocity.
Overall, the findings depict a Muslim community becoming more radical and feeling more alienated from mainstream society, even though 91 per cent still say they feel loyal to Britain.
Why let in members of such a hostile religion?
Muslims do not like us.
Public opinion in Britain is mostly favourable towards Muslims, but the feeling is not requited by British Muslims, who are among the most embittered in the western world, according to a global poll published yesterday.
The poll, by the Washington-based Pew Global Attitudes Project, asked Muslims and non-Muslims about each other in 13 countries. In most, it found suspicion and contempt to be mostly mutual, but uncovered a significant mismatch in Britain.
The poll found that 63% of all Britons had a favourable opinion of Muslims, down slightly from 67% in 2004, suggesting last year's London bombings did not trigger a significant rise in prejudice. Attitudes in Britain were more positive than in the US, Germany and Spain (where the popularity of Muslims has plummeted to 29%), and about the same as in France.
Less than a third of British non-Muslims said they viewed Muslims as violent, significantly fewer than non-Muslims in Spain (60%), Germany (52%), the US (45%) and France (41%).
By contrast, the poll found that British Muslims represented a "notable exception" in Europe, with far more negative views of westerners than Islamic minorities elsewhere on the continent. A significant majority viewed western populations as selfish, arrogant, greedy and immoral. Just over half said westerners were violent. While the overwhelming majority of European Muslims said westerners were respectful of women, fewer than half British Muslims agreed. Another startling result found that only 32% of Muslims in Britain had a favourable opinion of Jews, compared with 71% of French Muslims.
Shouldn't we keep Muslims out of the West to protect the Jews and ourselves?
Why let in a group where more than a tenth will see it self at war with your society?
A SIGNIFICANT minority of British Muslims believe they are at war with the rest of society, the largest poll of Muslims in this country suggests.
The Populus survey for The Times and ITV News has found that more than one in ten thinks that the men who carried out the London bombings of 7/7 should be regarded as “martyrs”. Sixteen per cent of British Muslims, equivalent to more than 150,000 adults, believe that while the attacks were wrong, the cause was right.
We can't live as a free society if 16% of our population thinks Jihad is a worthy cause. Why let in a group that would be poisonous as a majority?
Dragon Horse, tl;dr
The fact remains that Geert Wilders would have freedom of speech if they hadn't allowed people that don't believe in it in his free-speech country.
Speaking statistics, would you have unprotected sex with 1 person out of a hundred knowing that 5% of them had a deadly, communicable STD?
A cursory reading of European history will reveal that many times muslims tried(sometimes succesfully)to subjugate and forcefully covert Europeans to islam.
The stongest attempt came in the dark ages when Charles Martel succesfully routed the muslim armies at Tours.If Martel had failed the there is no doubt that all White Europeans would presently be muslims and yu'd be reading a blog by Mohammed Al-Parkeri rather than Randall Parker.
Spain was held for 400 years.Similarly the Ottomans destroyed Byzantium (the succesor of Rome)and subjugated the Greeks, Armenians, Serbs and other for 500 years.
Vienna (the heart of Mittel Europa) was besieged twice and as recently as the 1680s (yes, this *is* recent in European history)muslim armies ravaged central Europe and were a force to be reckoned with.
The Ottomans were not finally ejected from the main Balkan states unti the 1870s - only a few generations ago.
That's a good question. Find me a Muslim who doesn't believe the Arabic Koran is the unadulterated word of God in God's language of choice, and let's ask him.
More like 100 million. That's a big number.
The most comprehensive international survey on the opinion of Muslims worldwide gives pause:
Seven per cent believe that the events of 9/11 were “completely justified”.
The globe has more than 1.3 billion Muslims, so that comes to somewhere in the area of 100 million adherents professing support for the crashing of airplanes into skyscrapers and the massive loss of life that is the consequence. Put in another way, for every three Americans there is one person in the Muslim world who is in solidarity with Atta. That's an enormous number.
The survey data once again repudiates the flawed conventional wisdom stating that destitution leads to radicalization. The percentage of 'radicals' (supportive of terrorist attacks against the West) and 'moderates' (those who either are ambivalent or opposed to terrorist activity) on several social attributes follows:
Primary school or less:
Radicals - 23%
Moderates - 34%
Radicals - 44%
Moderates - 38%
Low or very low income:
Radicals - 22%
Moderates - 31%
Above average or very high income:
Radicals - 25%
Moderates - 21%
Expect to be better off in five years:
Radicals - 53%
Moderates - 44%
The Marxist explanations just don't work. We embrace them at our own peril. The civilizational clash runs much deeper than that. Disconnecting from the Islamic world, through prioritization of alternative energy research, a drastic curtailment of Islamic immigration to the West, and a reversal of the long-range plan for a substantial military footprint in the Muslim world, is the best strategy. Neocon nostrums claiming that militarily exporting liberal propositions will solve all our problems, and leftists' belief in essentially the same thing (with more emphasis on voluntary methods of exportation, and with more direct wealth transfer) will continue to accentuate rather than alleviate these problems, as both worldviews are at odds with reality.